(22 votes, average: 4.14 out of 5)
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Back in April of this year, HP introduced the world’s first value ultrathin notebook, the HP Pavilion dv2. It was chock full of AMD technologies like the new AMD AthlonTM Neo processor and even had an ATI RadeonTM discrete graphics card, all in a slim and affordable package. The press noticed. Could it get better? Let me give you my first impressions on the AMD 2nd generation ultrathin platform, introduced today along with our new “Vision Technology from AMD” campaign designed to de-mystify the PC buying experience. This time, I got to test out an MSI X-Series notebook and it impressed.
Notebook based on AMD’s Second Generation Ultrathin Platform
It’s real easy to describe the 2nd generation ultrathin design: Take the 1st generation, give it a second CPU core and take nearly the performance of the first generation’s discrete card, shrink it and place it into the chipset decreasing energy consumption. Oh yeah, and add sprinkles of VISION Technology. Easy, right? Don’t tell the engineers I said that.
Specs for MSI notebook based on AMD’s 2nd Generation Ultrathin Platform
- CPU: AMD Athlon Neo X2 Dual Core Processor L335 at 1.6 GHz.
- GPU: ATI Radeon HD 3200 Graphics
- Display: 12″ at 1366×768 resolution with HDMI for 1080P bliss and VGA port out
- RAM/HDD/Optical: 2GB (dual channel)/160GB/None
- Memory Slot: SD/SDHC/MMC
- Networking: Bluetooth, Gig-E, and BGN wireless
- 3 USB ports
- 1.3 MP Webcam
Size Matters
The best way to do a size comparison is to compare it to something someone may be familiar with. Below are comparisons to a BlackBerry Bold and an MSI U100 Netbook.
MSI notebook based on AMD’s 2nd Generation Ultrathin platform next to a BlackBerry Bold
MSI U100 Netbook next to MSI notebook based on AMD’s 2nd Generation Ultrathin platform
MSI U100 Netbook on top of an MSI notebook based on AMD’s 2nd Generation Ultrathin platform
HD Video Playback-Bring It On
The MSI ripped through HD video off of the web from YouTube HD as well as Hulu HD (to my surprise). I also played HD files from my Sony Webbie (1080P/30FPS) and Kodak ZI6 (720P/60FPS) inexpensive HD palmcorders and it didn’t even break a sweat. I plugged an external Blu-Ray drive and two movies with Cyberlink 8, “I Am Legend” and “Speed Racer”, and I never saw CPU utilization go above 25%. Add this to the ability to project externally at 1080P video to my HDTV along with high-fidelity audio over the HDMI port and cable and I was real happy.
Games- Not Sweating the Small Stuff
Like the AMD 1st generation ultrathin platform, the 2nd generation ultrathin platform can (of course) play mainstream games well like the Sims and Spore, but even the more hard-core games (albeit at low settings) like Left 4 Dead. I must caveat by saying that if you consider yourself a gamer, go for a system that has a higher end GPU like the higher end ATI Radeon HD 3000 or HD 4000 series. But if you play games but don’t consider yourself a gamer, no need to worry, you get a real ATI-branded graphics capability, not a generic brand in many systems.
Web Browsing- Flash Eater
I already described how this MSI notebook tore through YouTube HD and Hulu HD so why bring up anything else? Well, it’s called Flash and it’s the basis for a ton of web sites and it chews up inordinate amounts of power. Try this test- open up task manager to see how much CPU is being used then go to americanidol.com and then disney.com. If you have one of those underpowered machines, you know what happens. If you have a notebook based on the 2nd generation ultrathin platform, you get a good experience where the CPU isn’t pegging at 100%.
Conclusion
The 2nd generation ultrathin platform turned out exactly as I would have hoped: lighter, cooler, and more powerful to enable consumers to have an even better experience than they did with the first generation. No-compromise computing in a thin package at a good value. As “Active” and “Resting” battery life benchies go, the lab is working on those and I will update my blog when I get them. Until then, let me know if you have any questions.
Pat Moorhead is Vice President of Advanced Marketing at AMD. His postings are his own opinions and may not represent AMD’s positions, strategies or opinions. Links to third party sites are provided for convenience and unless explicitly stated, AMD is not responsible for the contents of such linked sites and no endorsement is implied.
(4.43 out of 5)
#1 by audiguy - September 9th, 2009 at 23:08
Great blog Pat – The dv2 seemed like a market winner, this new crop of notebooks from AMD look to be even better.
The technology features you guys are packing in these ultra thin nb’s are incredible… Great for video, gaming and basic prod apps…
#2 by Patrick Moorhead - September 9th, 2009 at 23:29
@audiguy, thanks for the comments. It’s a good day for consumers thats for sure. Will be interesting to see how consumers see this second gen ultrathins versus netbooks.
#3 by REMF - September 10th, 2009 at 04:30
Thanks for the blog Pat, couple of questions for you:
1) Is the 2nd gen ultra-thin platform DX 10.1, confusingly some marketing pages refer to it as DX 10.1?
2) Will you provide driver support for OpenCL in the 2nd Gen ultra-thin platform, as AMD has stated it will for Tigris?
Many thanks
#4 by Patrick Moorhead - September 10th, 2009 at 09:09
@REMF, thank for the questions. 2nd Gen UT has the Radeon 3200 which is DX 10. Tigris platform, with HD 4200 has DX 10.1. Let me check into OCL question.
#5 by REMF - September 10th, 2009 at 10:47
@Patrick Moorhead,
thanks, i look forward to the answer about OCL, i believe it is important.
#6 by Bobajob - September 12th, 2009 at 05:16
@REMF,
i think the answer Patrick doesn’t want to give is that OpenCL is not supported on DX10 Congo.
#7 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 14:01
@REMF, been on the road for a few weeks and apologize for the delay, but we haven’t determined OCL support on 780G line yet. Will let you know when we do.
#8 by Bobajob - September 11th, 2009 at 02:50
@Patrick Moorhead,
Hi Patrick, any news on OpenCL?
#9 by REMF - September 13th, 2009 at 12:19
@Bobajob,
have faith bobabjob, it would be inconsistent of AMD to rubbish Atom as suitable only for media consumption, whilst touting Congo as a genuine computing platform, and refuse to enable OpenCL on the new ultra-thin platform for marketing reasons.
AMD cannot afford to make that kind of mistake, especially not with Intel CULV nipping at its heels.
#10 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 14:01
@Bobajob, as I said to REMF, but we haven’t determined OCL support on 780G line yet. Will let you know when we do.
#11 by REMF - September 11th, 2009 at 10:43
@Patrick Moorhead,
any news on the OpenCL question?
#12 by Alexis_Moore - September 16th, 2009 at 09:35
@REMF,
Hey REMF,
Still feeling optimistic………………………..?
#13 by Alexis_Moore - September 13th, 2009 at 07:25
@Patrick Moorhead, This is something i want to know too cheers.
#14 by REMF - September 15th, 2009 at 03:36
@Alexis_Moore,
In spite of what i told Bobajob, I am getting a little dispirited by the lack of a response, as it indicates that PM is embarrassed to announce on his blog that AMD’s 2nd Gen ultra-thin platform is not a genuine computing platform after all.
#15 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 14:02
@Alexis_Moore, we haven’t determined whether or not we will support OCL on this platform.
#16 by drns - September 10th, 2009 at 07:34
1. What’s the TDP of this chip?
2. When it will be avaliable and what’s the exact name of the laptop you tested?
#17 by Patrick Moorhead - September 10th, 2009 at 09:12
@drns, thanks for the questions. Let me check into the exact TDP of the chips for you. Its important to add the entire TDP for CPU, northbridge and southbridge chipset, discrete GPU (if present).
I tested the MSI X430 and can’t divulge availability yet.
#18 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 12:19
@drns, apologies for the delay on the TDP. Two weeks on the road.
TDP for the dual core is 18watts. Remember, though this CPU is a real PC CPU, not one designed for smartphones. It provides a super-scalar, out of order execution platform that runs circles around competing netbooks. Try Hulu HD or Youtube HD on a netbook then try on a 2nd Gen Ultrathin. BIG difference.
#19 by NickM - September 10th, 2009 at 10:52
Hi Pat, thanks for the update on the latest ultrathin platforms. This sounds like the notebook my wife has been asking for, but I had questions about noise and heat:
Is it quiet, or is there a noisy fan going all the time?
Is it cool enough to use on your lap?
#20 by Patrick Moorhead - September 10th, 2009 at 13:58
@NickM, I thought it was very cool and quiet, so I could recommend that, yes.
#21 by Jim - October 4th, 2009 at 11:41
@Patrick Moorhead, Pat, You can show/use copyrighted content for research purposes. This is an exception to copyright law. Since you are publishing research on the capability of the chip it would qualify. You couldn’t show a full movie, but a short clip would be acceptable.
Jim
#22 by Jim - September 10th, 2009 at 12:47
You should post a you tube video showing the MSI with L335 playing Hulu HD smoothly. That would be a killer app. Because you work for AMD people might be skeptical of your claims in this post. A you tube video should settle that.
#23 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 12:17
@Jim, great idea. Would do that in a heartbeat if I could show licensed content but I cannot. Any ideas around that?
#24 by Rahul - October 20th, 2009 at 15:35
@Patrick Moorhead,
Related question: Will Flash 10.1 be accelerated by Radeon 3200 chip? Flash 10.1 is supposedly GPU accelerated but it is not clear which chips can take advantage of it.
#25 by Michael Bankwitz - September 11th, 2009 at 05:30
Thanks for the great blog. But now I have (maybe strange) questions:
What are the differences between the Socket S1g2 and Socket S1g3?
So it is possible to use a Turion II on a Puma-Notebook?
#26 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 13:37
@Michael Bankwitz, sorry for the delay. Here is the answer verbatim from one of our engineers:
“Griffin processors (65nm SOI) based on the “Revision G” core in the 638-pin package are the AMD Socket S1g2 processors.
Caspian processors (45nm SOI) based on the “Stars” core are the next-generation AMD mobile processors that will use the S1g3 infrastructure (very similar to S1g2 infrastructure).
It is not possible to use Turion II on a Puma-Notebook because, the BIOS will likely not support it. Caspian has a different CPUID (Family 10, Rev. C, Model 6).
Caspian has a shared power plane for both cores (Puma has separate power planes for each core)
Caspian infrastructure requires the VRM to support unified power plane for both cpu cores
It is not a validated combination (Caspian +rs780)”
Short answer is, “no”.
#27 by Ras - October 25th, 2009 at 23:11
So how about compatibility with S1G1?
Since they do not have split power planes.
#28 by Scott - September 12th, 2009 at 14:45
How’s the battery life with these more powerful chips?
#29 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 12:15
@Scott, battery life depends on a ton of variables, BUT all things equal we are seeing around a hour improvement in resting time on these platforms compared to Yukon. When you compare the discrete Yukon with the integrated Congo, you see around a two hour improvement.
#30 by Pierre - September 13th, 2009 at 21:50
Hi Pat,
Thank you for the exciting post. The AMD 2nd generation ultra-thin platform (Neo X2/RS780M) finally looks like the Intel netbook (Atom/945G) killer! I had briefly thought about getting a netbook next year with the new Intel Atom N470 SoC but its specs will still look anaemic compared to the AMD 2nd generation ultra-thin platform. The HP dv2z has been my #1 choice for an ultra-portable but I have been waiting for the 2nd gen platform release before making a purchase – the new MSI model could be a possible alternative. Some competition from MSI in the ultra-portable space will be good for consumers. Comparing the pictures above to the MSI website gallery pictures the demoed laptop looks more like a Wind U210 than the X-Series (the MSI logo on the top right-hand corner of the screen is absent in the X-Series) – I will be scanning the interwebs for more release details.
Cheers
Pierre
#31 by Brad - September 15th, 2009 at 12:22
Thanks for the helpful blog, but i do have a couple questions:
1st – Why does it seem like the Athlon Neo X2 is pushed rather than the Turion Neo X2?
2nd – Why do the Neo’s have comparatively far less L2 Cache than Intel’s CULV processors. Obviously i don’t know very much about processors, but is there some difference which allows AMD processors to offer comparative performance with less cache? Is cache important to a processors performance?
Thanks for your help.
#32 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 12:10
@Brad, thanks for the comment.
1) Turion has more raw performance than Athlon, but the price/perf/watt of the Athlon Neo is optimal for the form factor.
2) Cache memory is just one of many variables that go into determining how good an experience a user can expect.
For example, some think that Intel platforms have incredibly weak graphics that provide an awful game and video experience. So, things like cache memory play a part, but there are many other variables that are much more important. Hard drive speed is another one.
#33 by DJsmooth - September 18th, 2009 at 03:37
Hi Pat,
Does Congo support OpenCL?
#34 by Patrick Moorhead - September 28th, 2009 at 14:03
@DJsmooth, we haven’t decided on that yet. Is this something you want? If so, what would you like to do with it?
#35 by DJsmooth - September 30th, 2009 at 06:22
cheers for the reply Pat.
i want it for exactly the same reasons that someone buying the new caspian platform would want OpenCL, i.e because it is going to be part of our computing future.
AMD has managed to make a distinction between its ultra-thin platforms (read: netbook) and Intel’s Atom, precisely because Yukon and Congo are capable to genuine computing tasks rather than just media consumption.
However, if you want to keep that unique selling point in 2010 then Congo needs to support GP-GPU because that will come to be judged as essential for computing tasks.
I realise it must be tempting to AMD to limit OpenCL to Caspian for marketing reasons, but this would be a gross mistake as it would destroy the percieved distance you have thus far managed to create between Atom and AMD ultrathin platforms.
And given that the RV610 and RV620 are near identical GPU’s i would be suspicious if AMD told us they could not implement OpenCL on COngo for ‘technical’ reasons.
Ball’s in your court……………
#36 by Joet - October 1st, 2009 at 06:18
Hi Pat,
A few things I’m a bit confused on, I hope you can help clear them up –
(Note: I was going to include all my concerns in one comment, but for clarity and ease of addressment, I’ll put each into its own comment, so please bear with me.
References are made to “Congo.” I thought Congo was renamed to something else?
#37 by Patrick Moorhead - October 1st, 2009 at 09:42
@Joet, the new name that replaced Congo was “2nd Generation Ultrathin Platform”.
#38 by Adam - October 6th, 2009 at 20:05
Hi patrick!
Can you also give some clarification about the VISION branding?
As in which types of laptops will get the basic vision, premium, and ultimate vision sticker?
And i’m talking about tech. specs, unlike the vision website which only gives ‘vague usage scenarios’
So what specs come with each branding? That’d be awesome to know!
thanks!
#39 by Patrick Moorhead - October 7th, 2009 at 08:46
@Adam, thanks for the question. I have seen it and presented it publicly, so public info. Let me track down a link for you.
#40 by Adam - October 7th, 2009 at 17:11
@Patrick Moorhead, Awesome! Can’t wait to see it!!! Thanks!
#41 by Aerows - October 8th, 2009 at 21:42
Thanks for the look at this new laptop. I realize you can’t divulge when it will be released, but I’m really interested in getting an ultra portable and this is perfect.
Think it will be along soon, as in around when Windows 7 is released?
Also, I’d love to see some gaming benchmarks. Even just a 3dMark 06, but some numbers from HL2 and World of Warcraft would be great, because those are games people would realistically play on it. Though if you have some other benchmarks, I’d sure be thrilled to see them.
#42 by Abby - October 11th, 2009 at 21:31
Great blog Pat. The dv2 seems like a great notebook for nearly everyone. Looks like a good choice for me. I don’t consider myself a real big gamer.
#43 by Erin - October 19th, 2009 at 00:04
The dv2 is a poor excuse for a notebook. You obviously did not do your research.
#44 by Micah - October 22nd, 2009 at 11:20
Hmm, I’m kinda disappointed, I don’t see the MSI X430 out yet and it’s Win7 day! Maybe they (MSI) just couldn’t get it into production on time…
#45 by Brad - November 1st, 2009 at 18:15
Pat,
You mentioned that the L335/3200 combo ripped through even Hulu HD…I am wondering if you can help me out.
I am typing on a brand-new HP Dm3-1030US (L335/3200) and this computer is awesome! I am pleased by the performance, except full screen Hulu (360p and 480p) isn’t smooth. Is something wrong here?
***Also, can you please tell me if the Flash acceleration promised by Adobe and AMD will benefit the HD3200?
Thanks alot, I am otherwise quite happy with my machine!
Brad
#46 by Brad - November 2nd, 2009 at 19:40
I do not want to give anyone the wrong impression or make it sound like Pat is just making stuff up. So to clarify, my Dm3 (L335/3200) handles HD youtube, and even all non-full-screened-Hulu including HD Hulu perfectly. It just seems like full-screen Hulu is too much for it.
Pat, can you reassure me that the HD3200 will benefit from flash acceleration? Or can you suggest to the powers that be that they make sure that it does?
#47 by jannesschilderszoon - November 5th, 2009 at 10:28
Hi,
I just joined this site, because i have a burning question!
Last month I bought a Wii!!! Yeah!
I want to play backup wii games. How do I need to Wii Ombouwen?
Thank you in advance for your replies and help!!
Jannes
#48 by Robert Powell - November 9th, 2009 at 10:45
Getting a bit confused as I look for a new low end laptop. Will an AMD QL-65 give better performance than an AMD M300? Both have 4 GB ram whil the unit with the QL-65 has 500GB harddrive and 14″ screen for C$550 and the M300 unit has 250GB harddrive with 15.6″ screen for C$500. It seems like the QL-65 would be the way to go, but am I missing something? They both are similarly equipped other than shown and scfreen size is not an issue.
Robert
#49 by Robert Powell - November 10th, 2009 at 09:39
Hello,
Added to question #47. It turns out the unit with the QL-65 has the older Radeon 3200 video chip while the M300 has the 4200.
Thanks
Robert
#50 by Micah - November 11th, 2009 at 16:29
Hey Brad, I just got almost the same dm3 as you except mine is L610/3200. Hulu HD is fine in a window (not sure if ts 360/480/720p, I’ll find out) but not in fullscreen, as you said.
I’ll get around to it soon, but what about iTunes in HD?
And I too would love to know if the recently announced Flash 10.1 w/ GPU hardware acceleration would work on the HD3200…
#51 by ken green - November 13th, 2009 at 16:47
Again, OpenCL on the ATI HD 3200 780 with AMD Athlon 64 x2? I believe that this combo supports Stream. It is appearing in a lot of notebooks such as ACER’s AS5534 with 4G of RAM and W7
#52 by DJsmooth - November 17th, 2009 at 11:06
I’m still waiting for answer as to whether AMD will enable OpenCL on the 3200 iGPU………………….?
#53 by Patrick Moorhead - November 18th, 2009 at 09:19
Still attempting to get an answer.